One tree, two axes.

askmrjesus · 09-02-2011, 05:57 PM

Gibson Guitar Factories Raided by Feds

Gibson—the legendary instrument makers behind the Les Paul, SG and 335 guitar models—had its Memphis and Nashville factories and offices raided by federal agents last Wednesday, the Wall Street Journal reports.

The article said federal officials seized pallets of wood, electronic files and guitars. While federal officials have not commented on the investigation, Gibson CEO Henry Juszkiewicz led reporters to believe the issue was an environmental one, stating “The wood the government seized Wednesday is from a Forest Stewardship Council certified supplier.”

The article explains that the investigation’s pressing issue was probably the origin of the guitars’ wood:

The question in the first raid seemed to be whether Gibson had been buying illegally harvested hardwoods from protected forests, such as the Madagascar ebony that makes for such lovely fretboards. And if Gibson did knowingly import illegally harvested ebony from Madagascar, that wouldn’t be a negligible offense. Peter Lowry, ebony and rosewood expert at the Missouri Botanical Garden, calls the Madagascar wood trade the “equivalent of Africa’s blood diamonds.” But with the new raid, the government seems to be questioning whether some wood sourced from India met every regulatory jot and tittle.

But as the article explains, this isn’t only a hot issue for guitar manufacturers, but collectors as well:

If you are the lucky owner of a 1920s Martin guitar, it may well be made, in part, of Brazilian rosewood. Cross an international border with an instrument made of that now-restricted wood, and you better have correct and complete documentation proving the age of the instrument. Otherwise, you could lose it to a zealous customs agent—not to mention face fines and prosecution.

John Thomas, a law professor at Quinnipiac University and a blues and ragtime guitarist, says “there’s a lot of anxiety, and it’s well justified.” Once upon a time, he would have taken one of his vintage guitars on his travels. Now, “I don’t go out of the country with a wooden guitar.”

http://www.pastemagazine.com/article...d-by-feds.html

When Rosewood trees learn to play the blues all on their own, I'll start getting upset about cutting them down.

JC

Avatard · 09-02-2011, 07:47 PM

It's all political, of course.

That said, it couldn't happen to a more deserving company.

We are talking about the folks who bought, and then subsequently destroyed, just to name a few:

Tobias basses
Steinberger basses
Opcode software
Arp Synthesizers
Maestro products
Wurlitzer keyboards
Kramer guitars

...and so many more!

Yep...that and that fact that they pretend that their headstocks are made correctly, when nearly a 20% break in the field, and just switching to a scarf joint would fix the issue, like nearly every other modern guitar manufacturer has done.

http://www.edroman.com/rants/les_paul_necks.htm

Yep, that's what makes me say; couldn't happen to a nicer bunch of guys.

fujimoh · 09-03-2011, 09:33 AM

I heard the CEO of the company say in an interview that the feds told him, "All these problems would go away if you moved your production to another country."

Homeslice · 09-16-2011, 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fujimoh

I heard the CEO of the company say in an interview that the feds told him, "All these problems would go away if you moved your production to another country."

Of course he's going to say that.

Avatard · 09-03-2011, 11:37 AM

That's a given. This is what we do to people who want to work in this country, or form a corp...we overwhelm them with administrative regulation.

I remember when Tobias had to move his spray booth to Mexico, because the California EPA wouldn't let him spray guitar finishes anymore.

Trip · 09-03-2011, 11:47 AM

protected wood should be protected, this is as liberal as I get, I am a big advocate for our protected parks/forests/land.

Avatard · 09-04-2011, 01:17 AM

Why Gibson Guitar Was Raided By The Justice Department

Homeslice · 09-16-2011, 01:37 PM

Oh and I would like to know if this exotic wood actually improves the sound quality over the best legal alternatives. If it doesn't, then the people who buy them are just buying them to impress others.

askmrjesus · 09-16-2011, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Homeslice

Oh and I would like to know if this exotic wood actually improves the sound quality over the best legal alternatives. If it doesn't, then the people who buy them are just buying them to impress others.

The short answer is yes.

The long answer is longer.

JC

Particle Man · 09-16-2011, 02:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Homeslice

Oh and I would like to know if this exotic wood actually improves the sound quality over the best legal alternatives. If it doesn't, then the people who buy them are just buying them to impress others.

Longer than "yes" - "definitely"

Different wood produces different sound in any instrument including drums.

09-02-2011, 05:57 PM	#1
askmrjesus Soul Man Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Everywhere, all the time. Moto: '0000 Custom Turbo Cross (with jet kit). Posts: 6,481	One tree, two axes. Gibson Guitar Factories Raided by Feds Gibson—the legendary instrument makers behind the Les Paul, SG and 335 guitar models—had its Memphis and Nashville factories and offices raided by federal agents last Wednesday, the Wall Street Journal reports. The article said federal officials seized pallets of wood, electronic files and guitars. While federal officials have not commented on the investigation, Gibson CEO Henry Juszkiewicz led reporters to believe the issue was an environmental one, stating “The wood the government seized Wednesday is from a Forest Stewardship Council certified supplier.” The article explains that the investigation’s pressing issue was probably the origin of the guitars’ wood: The question in the first raid seemed to be whether Gibson had been buying illegally harvested hardwoods from protected forests, such as the Madagascar ebony that makes for such lovely fretboards. And if Gibson did knowingly import illegally harvested ebony from Madagascar, that wouldn’t be a negligible offense. Peter Lowry, ebony and rosewood expert at the Missouri Botanical Garden, calls the Madagascar wood trade the “equivalent of Africa’s blood diamonds.” But with the new raid, the government seems to be questioning whether some wood sourced from India met every regulatory jot and tittle. But as the article explains, this isn’t only a hot issue for guitar manufacturers, but collectors as well: If you are the lucky owner of a 1920s Martin guitar, it may well be made, in part, of Brazilian rosewood. Cross an international border with an instrument made of that now-restricted wood, and you better have correct and complete documentation proving the age of the instrument. Otherwise, you could lose it to a zealous customs agent—not to mention face fines and prosecution. John Thomas, a law professor at Quinnipiac University and a blues and ragtime guitarist, says “there’s a lot of anxiety, and it’s well justified.” Once upon a time, he would have taken one of his vintage guitars on his travels. Now, “I don’t go out of the country with a wooden guitar.” http://www.pastemagazine.com/article...d-by-feds.html When Rosewood trees learn to play the blues all on their own, I'll start getting upset about cutting them down. JC __________________ The way things are going, they're gonna crucify me.

09-02-2011, 07:47 PM	#2
Avatard Crotch Rocket Curmudgeon Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Here to integrity Moto: Li'l red baby Ninja Posts: 7,482	It's all political, of course. That said, it couldn't happen to a more deserving company. We are talking about the folks who bought, and then subsequently destroyed, just to name a few: Tobias basses Steinberger basses Opcode software Arp Synthesizers Maestro products Wurlitzer keyboards Kramer guitars ...and so many more! Yep...that and that fact that they pretend that their headstocks are made correctly, when nearly a 20% break in the field, and just switching to a scarf joint would fix the issue, like nearly every other modern guitar manufacturer has done. http://www.edroman.com/rants/les_paul_necks.htm Yep, that's what makes me say; couldn't happen to a nicer bunch of guys. __________________ Insert free thought here.

09-03-2011, 11:37 AM	#5
Avatard Crotch Rocket Curmudgeon Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Here to integrity Moto: Li'l red baby Ninja Posts: 7,482	That's a given. This is what we do to people who want to work in this country, or form a corp...we overwhelm them with administrative regulation. I remember when Tobias had to move his spray booth to Mexico, because the California EPA wouldn't let him spray guitar finishes anymore. __________________ Insert free thought here.

09-04-2011, 01:17 AM	#7
Avatard Crotch Rocket Curmudgeon Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Here to integrity Moto: Li'l red baby Ninja Posts: 7,482	Why Gibson Guitar Was Raided By The Justice Department __________________ Insert free thought here.

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09-03-2011, 09:33 AM	#3
fujimoh Kneedragger Join Date: May 2011 Location: Florida Moto: CBR 1000RR Posts: 230	I heard the CEO of the company say in an interview that the feds told him, "All these problems would go away if you moved your production to another country."

09-16-2011, 01:37 PM	#8
Homeslice Elitist Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: SF Bay Area Moto: Gix 750 Posts: 11,351	Oh and I would like to know if this exotic wood actually improves the sound quality over the best legal alternatives. If it doesn't, then the people who buy them are just buying them to impress others.